[PNW Islander]

are the K&K socks accepted by the chain control posts ( highway patrol, DOT?do you you even have them in Oregon?

Yes, we have chain control posts and mandates in OR and WA (I’m in WA). I was actually just thinking about this on the way down the mountain yesterday as I confidently passed the sign mandating chains. Short answer… I’m not sure, but let’s find out if they come under existing code language or if changes are needed.

Regardless, they seem to work as well as chains… which is crazy, but really great!

I have read reviews that they don’t last long - particularly if you get on roads that are partial snow / partial asphalt. I took mine off when I cleared the worst snow in order to avoid this but did drive them for about five miles on mixed conditions before finding a good place to turn off and absolutely no issues whatsoever.

 

[PNW Islander]

Thanks for the description of your experience! Does the Webasto keep up with heat loss through the canvas. We had issues with heat loss in a Westy with a Propex heater if the temps were 20F or below. Great that the socks work - I'll be getting a set. We used telescoping poles to hold up the poptop on our Westy filled with 5 whitewater kayaks; never had a problem with snow accumulation but the Westy design is more substantial than the SCA 152. I'll be putting those poles in when/if we expect snow on camp trips! Thanks for the heads up.

There is definitely loss but the Webasto keeps up fine - even upstairs in the “loft” when running. The difference is that a few minutes after it shuts off the cold begins to permeate in and about 30-40min later the van is getting pretty cool. I think we ran three or four cycles a night to keep the van warm. There was an earlier post about insulation for the canvass which could be something else to look into?

 

[pounce]

Example for the Marco Polo

https://vwcaliforniaclub.com/shop/product/comfortz-mercedes-marco-polo-mp-wrap-thermal-roof-wrap

 

[PNW Islander]

Example for the Marco Polo

https://vwcaliforniaclub.com/shop/product/comfortz-mercedes-marco-polo-mp-wrap-thermal-roof-wrap

Ok… This looks very promising!

 

[schlabinski]

@PNW Islander thanks for sharing your latest adventure at the mountain! I have some questions...

You mentioned you cooked your dinner inside the van. What kind of stove are you using inside the van? Does that require some ventilation?

Also curious about how camping in the cold weather works. Do you get a lot of condensation? Do you crack a window or does that just let in too much cold air? Do you have insulated window coverings?

Can you share more about how you use the Webasto? Do you turn it on and let it run for the timed 2 hours? And then do you subsequently have to manually turn it on every time you need heat? Or can you set it and forget it and let it do its thing all night?

I'm intrigued by the tire socks. I have a set of chains, but these might be nice to have on hand as well.

Thanks again and best of luck in all your future adventures. Please keep on sharing and inspiring!

 

[pounce]

@PNW Islander
Can you share more about how you use the Webasto? Do you turn it on and let it run for the timed 2 hours? And then do you subsequently have to manually turn it on every time you need heat? Or can you set it and forget it and let it do its thing all night?

They have thermostats.

Metris Camper Van Add-Ons — Peace Vans

Want to enhance your camping experience? Whether you’re starting the camper van conversion process or you’re looking to level up your current build out, we offer a wide selection of upgrades and accessories to bring convenience and comfort to your next road trip.

www.peacevans.com

 

[PNW Islander]

@PNW Islander thanks for sharing your latest adventure at the mountain! I have some questions...

You mentioned you cooked your dinner inside the van. What kind of stove are you using inside the van? Does that require some ventilation?

Also curious about how camping in the cold weather works. Do you get a lot of condensation? Do you crack a window or does that just let in too much cold air? Do you have insulated window coverings?

Can you share more about how you use the Webasto? Do you turn it on and let it run for the timed 2 hours? And then do you subsequently have to manually turn it on every time you need heat? Or can you set it and forget it and let it do its thing all night?

I'm intrigued by the tire socks. I have a set of chains, but these might be nice to have on hand as well.

Thanks again and best of luck in all your future adventures. Please keep on sharing and inspiring!

@PNW Islander thanks for sharing your latest adventure at the mountain! I have some questions...

You mentioned you cooked your dinner inside the van. What kind of stove are you using inside the van? Does that require some ventilation?

Also curious about how camping in the cold weather works. Do you get a lot of condensation? Do you crack a window or does that just let in too much cold air? Do you have insulated window coverings?

Can you share more about how you use the Webasto? Do you turn it on and let it run for the timed 2 hours? And then do you subsequently have to manually turn it on every time you need heat? Or can you set it and forget it and let it do its thing all night?

I'm intrigued by the tire socks. I have a set of chains, but these might be nice to have on hand as well.

Thanks again and best of luck in all your future adventures. Please keep on sharing and inspiring!

@PNW Islander thanks for sharing your latest adventure at the mountain! I have some questions...

You mentioned you cooked your dinner inside the van. What kind of stove are you using inside the van? Does that require some ventilation?

Also curious about how camping in the cold weather works. Do you get a lot of condensation? Do you crack a window or does that just let in too much cold air? Do you have insulated window coverings?

Can you share more about how you use the Webasto? Do you turn it on and let it run for the timed 2 hours? And then do you subsequently have to manually turn it on every time you need heat? Or can you set it and forget it and let it do its thing all night?

I'm intrigued by the tire socks. I have a set of chains, but these might be nice to have on hand as well.

Thanks again and best of luck in all your future adventures. Please keep on sharing and inspiring!

I had the wonderful folks at Peace Vans install the side windows in my van so I crack one of those just behind the stove when cooking. These windows make camping and driving (particularly with anyone in the back) so much better! They are a must and work great and even have a screen so you can open the windows in the middle of the Baja desert and not get bugs inside!

As Pounce posted, the Webasto has a thermostat so i set a temp and let it go through its cycle. On this trip my daughter or I would wake up at some point due to wind or temp cooling inside the van and turn on the heater again and let it run through its cycle again. As I wrote earlier, even with the top up, both downstairs and the loft stayed warm with Webasto on. There is also a great post in this thread about insulating the top to retain heat even better. I think we restarted the heater three times during the evening on this trip with pretty cold temps outside. This and some great blankets or sleeping bag and you’re set!

You can see descriptions of the Webasto heater upgrade and the side windows here (Upgrades | Mercedes Metris Camper Vans — Peace Vans)

The stove we use is a Selkirk 540 GSIOutdoors (GSI Outdoors Selkirk 540 2-Burner Camp Stove | REI Co-op). It is a really nice unit with basic two burner setup that burns well. I generally set it up on the table with the cracked window behind it and don’t seem to lose too much heat - and there is heat off the stove so sort of equals out overall. I’ve never had issues with gas from the stove but also try not to cook too long.

As with any van, and particularly with two or more people, it is compact and unfortunately you have to put the table and stove away to make the bed down stairs - if you need both beds… but if that is the price I pay for a full day of incredible fresh powder snowboarding with my daughter, I’ll take it!

(cooking up some Italian sausage before adding onions, red peppers, garlic and whole peeled tomatoes to go over some wonderful Gnocchi)

(

 

[schlabinski]

As Pounce posted, the Webasto has a thermostat so i set a temp and let it go through its cycle. On this trip my daughter or I would wake up at some point due to wind or temp cooling inside the van and turn on the heater again and let it run through its cycle again. As I wrote earlier, even with the top up, both downstairs and the loft stayed warm with Webasto on. There is also a great post in this thread about insulating the top to retain heat even better. I think we restarted the heater three times during the evening on this trip with pretty cold temps outside. This and some great blankets or sleeping bag and you’re set!

Thanks for the additional detail about cooking in the van. We have the thermostat too, but haven't quite mastered the interface yet. After turning it on and selecting a temperature, aren't you given a timer? So rather than have to manually intervene in the night, do you think it would work to set it for something like 50 degrees and then set the timer to zero?

 

[schlabinski]

While performing our monthly heater run, I played with the thermostat a little more. It looks like the timer has a minimum of 10 minutes and a max of 2 hours. I couldn't find a way around that to enable it to run without intervention through the night. I'll keep researching.

 

[RobPNW]

While performing our monthly heater run, I played with the thermostat a little more. It looks like the timer has a minimum of 10 minutes and a max of 2 hours. I couldn't find a way around that to enable it to run without intervention through the night. I'll keep researching.

We noticed the same issue when starting the heater using the green power button. I believe this activates the quick start function which limits the timer to 2 hours. We found that if you turn on the heater using the selector knob (just press it to turn on) the timer can be set to "infinity."

Also, we haven't been shy about cranking up the temp. Recently out in 20 degree weather and set the heater to 68. It performed wonderfully, without notable fuel consumption, and no waking up to turn the heater back on!

 

[schlabinski]

We noticed the same issue when starting the heater using the green power button. I believe this activates the quick start function which limits the timer to 2 hours. We found that if you turn on the heater using the selector knob (just press it to turn on) the timer can be set to "infinity."

Also, we haven't been shy about cranking up the temp. Recently out in 20 degree weather and set the heater to 68. It performed wonderfully, without notable fuel consumption, and no waking up to turn the heater back on!

Thanks @RobPNW! I'll give that a try next time. Good to know there's a way to set it and let it maintain the temp all night.

 

[PNW Islander]

Another evening on the mountain waiting for morning powder! And… I was the only car in the lot that wasn’t four-wheel-drive.

This time however the road conditions deteriorated much sooner than normal and I was forced to stop and sock up only part way up the mountain. The K&K socks again performed incredibly well! It is a significant difference in traction. Not quite as good as 4x4 but close, really close. …and likely better for breaking. I took it slow and steady (though not stupidly slow, just safe slow) and got to the top of the mountain just fine!

Once I arrived I checked the forecast again - by simply looking out the window, and even though I had my GreenIsland LockPro poles to brace the pop up top, I decided not to pop the “loft” as it was just me and more importantly… I found out the hard way last time that it is a lot of work to clean the snow out of the gutters and off the canvass well enough in order for it to close properly. I’ve decided that when it’s forecast to get a good amount of snow and I don’t want to spend the time cleaning the roof before I leave, I’ll keep the top down and suffer with less head room. Well, the head out the window forecast held true and we got a lot of snow.

The evening went swell, with more stove top cooking inside the van and an excellent Malbec. The Webasto heater worked great, maybe too great as it was actually too hot with the top down so I turned it off halfway through the evening.

This afternoon after digging out the front of the car out of over two feet of snow, I left with the socks on but soon took them off and found that the car performed very well on just the Michelin Ice X tires - which are super good snow tires!

Another adventure completed. (Oh… and the Mountain was so very worth it today for any of you skiers or boarders!) #snow #peacevan #k&ksocks

(image of the road on the way up with the socks performing perfectly)

(Only 30 min after I reached the top)

(the only non-4x4 in the place!)

 

[rdyoung]

Absolutely love this thread, thank you for sharing and keep up the inspiring work. My van showed up today so I'm really looking forward to getting it setup for similar ski adventures. I have studded Nokians going on this week, I'm guessing they would tear up the k&ksocks?

 

[Le Manchot]

Just got a set of the K&Ks... hoping not to have to use them but we are taking a trip from ID to AZ and back in April. The route crosses a number of mountain ranges in fickle spring weather (meaning anything from 70 and clear to a snow blizzard). To drive around southern AZ we need to take the Hakkapeliittas off (studs are not allowed) and put the KO2s on which is where the socks will come in to play if we hit any significant snow on the trip. Thanks for the recommendation and sharing your experience.

 

[PNW Islander]

Absolutely love this thread, thank you for sharing and keep up the inspiring work. My van showed up today so I'm really looking forward to getting it setup for similar ski adventures. I have studded Nokians going on this week, I'm guessing they would tear up the k&ksocks?

I’m worried the studs may impact the socks more than my Michelin Ice X. For my driving I was more interested in traction on snow than ice. There is no question that on ice, studded tires preform well. But in deep snow, what you need is an exceptionally good snow tire. After a ridiculous amount of research I landed on the Ice X and have been impressed.

Then I found - after way more research than I ever wanted to do - the K&K tire socks and …am totally blown away at the combination. While I’ve ordered another pair of socks for the front, I’m not sure I need them. The combination of the Michelin Ice X tires up front and the super easy to put on and take off socks and I’m… we’ll, the only two wheel drive vehicle on top of a mountain in a blizzard with two feet of snow.

 

[jwatches]

I have a 2021 Metris Peace Van Weekender conversion. I have taken it to Baja three times and am spending several days a month in the Cascades sleeping in blizzards waiting for fresh powder.

I have a 1.5 inch lift with 225/65/17 Yokohama Geolandar A/T for Baja and Michelin Ice X Studless Snowtires for the mountains. I bought this incredible van for the same reason as many who own Metris Campers - I wanted something that I could camp and adventure in but also drive around town and actually fit in a parking place or on the ferry to the island where I live without being over-height. I also however… and this is a must, need a car that can get me to mountains in the middle of a snow storm and to remote surf spots in baja. While a 4x4 Sprinter was the obvious choice (and a similar price to the Peace Van conversion), for the reasons above, I wanted to try the Metris. …I also like bucking the trend and seeing one less Sprinter on the road.

Baja: while the Peace Van with the slight lift is amazing for Baja on and off road, I have gotten stuck a few times and simply can not access some of my favorite spots. Also, on my second trip, with only 25k miles on the rig, I blew out both rear shocks and found myself driving north to the Escondido Mercedes dealer where the staff were wonderful and replaced both under warranty. And, to clarify, I was not driving hard, just slowly off road.

This said, the van has performed really well in many situations where I thought it would not including soft sand and mud. And while I could not drive into a few remote spots, having a smaller van that handles well that also has all that a Peace Van offers, is really nice - AND SAFER - on narrow, windy, sketchy Mex 1 with psycho bus and truck drivers passing within inches of your side view mirror at 90 MPH. I have driven Mex 1 for over thirty years and several times in wider vehicles and it is pure white knuckle high stress driving. The Metris on the otherhand is a wonderful safe commuter. I am also going to install custom LED light bar to be countersunk into the front bumper (where license plate would normally be) for better vision and also considering upgrading tires for even better traction. When off-road, I’m typically running 15-18 PSI which helps, but would appreciate others suggestions on tires and traction ideas. I have also spent a lot of time looking for aftermarket shocks and have found nothing so far that would be a significant upgrade from stock. Again, would love input here!

Mountains: The greatest bonus, which is the same as in Baja is that the Peace Van Weekender is an amazing conversation which offers two full beds (sleeping four!) in a combination of westfelia type pop top and fold down rear bench. This combined with the kitchenette out the back, awning, heater and duel batteries makes it an incredible mountain snow and Baja desert camper.

I’ve had my Peace Van in some pretty deep snow (6-7” fresh) and done well, but I have not really pushed it in some of the conditions I would push my past all wheel drive cars or trucks. I have also, on a few occasions, lost tractions, once on ice in plowed parking area - which made me second guess going stud-less and twice in deeper snow where the incline of the road exceeded the traction of the van. I will say that I did a lot of research before settling on the Michelin Ice X and am overall very impressed. My issue is rarely ice but more often deep snow. For that, the Ice X continues to surpass its competition in traction, stoping. I’m also impressed with the weight distribution of the Metris with good weight over both front and rear axles allowing for better traction as opposed to how pickup trucks offer perform. View attachment 22463
View attachment 22462

I wanted to begin this discussion to see whom else in the Metris world is pushing the limits of their van and is willing to share their recent insights and experiences. I’ll update this forum with pictures and more stories as I continue to see where my Metris can take me and if I’ll be able to keep it.

I have found that my Metris is a slightly less capable off-road vehicle than the Westfalia I owned before. The limited ability to lift a Metris w/o spending serious money is really the limiting factor. On the other hand, I have found my Metris is a far better snow car than my Westfalia was. I run studded snows on all four wheels in the Winter and primarily drive to various ski hills. Snow build up has ruined the first set of mud flaps many on this forum have bought from Ebay, so I'm planning to do something more robust for next season.

For our camping, the Metris has been awesome. I had similar criteria, which basically boiled down to a modern Westfalia. My set-up is for 4-5 day off-grid travel, so it has a 20 gallon water tank and 400amp/hr of battery, etc., which add a lot of weight. To help with that I installed air bags in the rear which have really been a game changer. I also installed a Webasto gas heater to avoid the propane tank.

I don't really have any extreme use cases, but I have found that rough dirt roads, even with the air bags, requires me to slow down more than I did in the Westfalia. Besides the ground clearance mentioned before, the Metris has softer suspension than my Westy had. Again, full suspension upgrades for a Metris are orders of magnitude more costly than for a Westy, so I can't justify that for what I use the van for. That being said, the Metris has a much better ride on the highway, is much quieter, gets over 20mpg, and can go all day at 80 mph.

 

[PNW Islander]

I have found that my Metris is a slightly less capable off-road vehicle than the Westfalia I owned before. The limited ability to lift a Metris w/o spending serious money is really the limiting factor. On the other hand, I have found my Metris is a far better snow car than my Westfalia was. I run studded snows on all four wheels in the Winter and primarily drive to various ski hills. Snow build up has ruined the first set of mud flaps many on this forum have bought from Ebay, so I'm planning to do something more robust for next season.

For our camping, the Metris has been awesome. I had similar criteria, which basically boiled down to a modern Westfalia. My set-up is for 4-5 day off-grid travel, so it has a 20 gallon water tank and 400amp/hr of battery, etc., which add a lot of weight. To help with that I installed air bags in the rear which have really been a game changer. I also installed a Webasto gas heater to avoid the propane tank.

I don't really have any extreme use cases, but I have found that rough dirt roads, even with the air bags, requires me to slow down more than I did in the Westfalia. Besides the ground clearance mentioned before, the Metris has softer suspension than my Westy had. Again, full suspension upgrades for a Metris are orders of magnitude more costly than for a Westy, so I can't justify that for what I use the van for. That being said, the Metris has a much better ride on the highway, is much quieter, gets over 20mpg, and can go all day at 80 mph.

Thanks for your post!

I am finding my #peacevan to be a very capable car in the snow, but less impressive off road - which is why I’m still trying to secure a front differential to do a conversion and hope to upgrade the shocks as discussed below. In the snow, I’m actually very impressed with the performance and would actually say it is the best non-4x4 I’ve driven in serious snow.

(Image of the uphill climb the PeaceVan made with her socks on)

I unfortunately totally agree with you regarding off road however. As I mentioned in an early post, I blew out both rear shock on my last baja adventure forcing me to drive carefully 750 miles back to the boarder to get them replaced - with the same stock shocks as I could find no alternatives. That was a rough ride home as even the slightest bumps would bottom out and cause a lot of stress for my daughter and mother in law who were in the back for most of the drive - luckily Baja is beautiful and driving slow meant more taco stops.

I have done three trips over the years to the tip of Baja in a Westfalia (most of my trips over the past decades have been in SUVs or trucks). On all three trips I was extremely impressed with the traction and overall ability of the VW. There was actually one time we pulled out a stuck Toyota 4Runner with my buddies Westfalia - which greatly shocked the Toyota owner. The VW simply has better traction and off-road capabilities than the Metris - they also however had years of aftermarket parts available which may come for us in the future?

All of this said, I am really excited about what @schlabinski posted earlier about the great work he did on his #peacevan to address this very issue using the twin mono tube kit from Germany. His conversation is promising and seems to greatly address this issue! Please chime in @schlabinski

I definitely want to pursue this idea as it is clear that keeping the stock shocks is not an option if my van is going to do more time in Baja - which is a must as we do about four trips a year several hundred miles down.

Here is the link to the upgrade: TWIN-MONOTUBE-PROJEKT-LIFT447 Mercedes V CLASS W447 COMPLETE LIFT KIT | TWIN-MONOTUBE-PROJEKT

And… to clarify, when I blew out the shocks, it was not serious off-roading, it was simply dirt roads and sand at slower speeds in order to get to special surf spots - which is critical. As you and others obviously know well, it is one thing to visit Baja or any destination through the eyes of a resort or highway, it is entirely another to take the dirt road off to a remote location where you can experience the true magic of that place. In the end, it is why we all bought vans, right?!?!

Thank you again for your post @jwatches. I’m looking forward to your and others’ thoughts on how we can continue to improve the ability of our vans to reach the incredible places we need to go.

 

[harleysitner]

Let's do this. I'll follow up with the vendor next week.

Harley

 

[PNW Islander]

Drying Gear, Drying the Canvass PopTop, Batteries and Where to put Boards and Skis!

I received some questions off line that I’m sharing here so others can chime in with their ideas. Looking forward to hearing what others are doing to address these issues!

questions:

• If you’re staying over night for 2 days of skiing, how do you handle drying gear, skis, humidity?
• When you get home, how are you drying things back out? Do you park it inside? Any issues with drying out a damp canopy?
• Do you have the upgraded aux battery from PV? It’s apparently not good in the cold. The stop working around 32f and need to be warmed up before they work. Have you solved this or do you worry about freezing the battery?
• I see rails and no cargo box. You just slide the skis/boards inside? I think I can sneak it into the garage with the rails but a cargo box will likely be a tight squeeze. Ideally I can get it into the garage put a fan in there and dry it out after skiing

my responses:

1) The handles that you use to lower the roof when it is popped up work great! I have some S shaped carabiners from Helly Hansen that work fantastic but any S shaped hook will do! When the roof is up, the area that you crawl trough to access the upper bed is open (above the front seats). I place the gear that needs drying (coat, bibs, gloves) on hooks hanging from the handles and there is enough distance for them to hang free and air dry from the handles to the seats - and the heat from the Webasto is circulating right through there from its vent. I have tubs that still fit under the rear bench seat when it is folded down as a bed that I place on the front seats to catch any dripping or melting snow.

2) in order to get the roof closed securely you have to clean it really well of snow as I briefly touched upon in my last post. However, as you point out, the canvass can still be wet and after time this will likely be an issue if not dried-out. Our obvious issue in the NorthWest is that when we get home it may be raining so popping the top then won’t help if you’re like me and don’t have a garage. I have try to open the top within a day or two of returning from a snow trip for an hour or so even if it overcast and cold - just to get some air through it without the moisture. I also towel dry it before closing it on the mountain if it’s not snowing too hard. I’ve not had an issue at all so far, but as we’ve seen with old VWs, mold can form after awhile so important to pay attention. Wondering if others have ideas here?

3) I have the stock duel batteries from PeaceVans under the seats and they have performed really well down to 10 degrees Fahrenheit for four days. On the fourth day, I got the low battery alert on the Webasto.

4) I have recently been putting boards across the back behind the bench but it’s tight and I’m going to move to my other alternative going forward which is off the back as I explain below.

Before I go into the solution I’ve decided on, I’ll share that I also have used Thule snowboard racks that are vertical and Mount off the racks on my roof. (www.gg2022buyer.com). They are light weight and work great, but then I’m over height on the ferry which is the same as your issue with the garage and as I discuss below, more weight on the roof adds other problems when camping.

The aha moment I had was to begin using a box that attaches to the trailer receiver hitch - Basically a cargo box on the back instead of the top that is nearly as wide as the car. It can fit boards, wet gear and more! It is similar to this: https://www.etrailer.com/Hitch-Carg...MIhfG09Jji_QIVuB-tBh0HjgibEAQYAyABEgKRJfD_BwE

There are also racks that go on the back that I’ve looked into that work really well but are not enclosed so just skis and boards and not gear, but much lighter and easier to lift in and out of the trailer receiver. Example: http://buzzrack.com/galleries/buzzski-h/

For my snow trips, I feel mounting off the back as opposed to the roof with either the rear box or rear rack is the way to go for five reasons…

1) you maintain a lower (under 7’) total roof height which gets you not only into your garage but onto ferries or parking garage or other lower clearance places.
2) you can access your gear without a step stool (as no one I’ve found makes a mounted ladder for Metris - anyone know different?)
3) your roof wieght is not increased and you can still pop the top without removing gear! With only a lightweight rack and one surfboard, the roof was much harder to lift and would not stay up on its own without the use of poles to hold it up on the inside.
4) You can take it off easy by slipping it out of the trailer hitch receiver so you only need it attached while going somewhere requiring boards or skis but you can remove it and store it other times. Technically you can do this with a rocket box on the roof too… but seems no one does. Maybe because you need a step stool?
5) You are adding weight to the rear end! Have you ever seen people put wood or even a bail of hay in the back of their pickup truck in the winter to get better traction over the rear tires? Well, having a cargo box with boards and other gear in it, while not even close to as much weight as a bail of hay, is still adding weight over your rear axle which only benefits traction in the snow.

 

[pounce]

A Yakima Exo might be another option for gear. You can buy their gear mounts, but you can also buy the cradles that fit and make whatever mount type you need. Like a generator mount or custom board rack.

I am fortunate to have a garage that permits me to pop the top inside to let it dry out. I grew up in Seattle so I get being moist all the time. Finding a parking deck or awning to park for a few hours with the webasto running is probably a good alternative to get things dried out.